The Pledge of Allegiance is Indoctrination!

[sarcasticsteve]

http://www.enotes.com/soc/group/discuss/...hing-15353

A Sociology teacher made the point to her class that The Pledge of Allegiance is a form of indoctrination, similar to practices used by Communist Russia & the Nazis.  A student goes online asking if his/her teacher is playing Devil's Advocate or is actually a commie, and the replies actually prove how idiotic some people are in this country...

-Steve

[fyre]

Yes. It is a form of indoctrination. Some people think it's a good form, others think it's a bad form. I personally don't think it's terribly harmful compared to some of the other shit that kids have to do in school. That said, if a kid refuses to say it, good for him or her.

[Surf314]

It is what it says on the tin:  the pledge of allegiance

Now whether having kids pledge allegiance to something is a good thing or not is up for interpretation.  But it says what it is right in the title.

[cannedpeahes]

It is what it says on the tin:  the pledge of allegiance

Now whether having kids pledge allegiance to something is a good thing or not is up for interpretation.  But it says what it is right in the title.

With anything like that you trade a bit of personal agency for national identity, IMHO. It's a question of what your culture values more.

What's super scary is the people in the comments suggesting that the student file a formal complaint, without having any clue what actually happened in the class themselves. It's very Red Scare.

[Geoff]

[quote author=Surf314 link=topic=2808.msg80381#msg80381 date=1241467830]
It is what it says on the tin:  the pledge of allegiance

Now whether having kids pledge allegiance to something is a good thing or not is up for interpretation.  But it says what it is right in the title.

With anything like that you trade a bit of personal agency for national identity, IMHO. It's a question of what your culture values more.

What's super scary is the people in the comments suggesting that the student file a formal complaint, without having any clue what actually happened in the class themselves. It's very Red Scare.
[/quote]

Red Scare?

EMBRACE RED, COMRADE.

[Wedge]

Just based on the language in that original posting, I'm sad someone that dumb is even allowed into college.  I mean seriously, "My parents told me that some people at university are not trustable. Is she a subversive terrorist?". 

[shoopfox]

I loved the comments about reporting the teacher for being a kooky unpatriotic communist.

[rumsfald]

[tt]Almost overnight the Glorious Loyalty Oath Crusade was in full flower, and Captain Black was enraptured to discover himself spearheading it. He had really hit on something. All the enlisted men and officers on combat duty had to sign a loyalty oath to get their map cases from the intelligence tent, a second loyalty oath to receive their flak suits and parachutes from the parachute tent, a third loyalty oath for Lieutenant Balkington, the motor vehicle officer, to be allowed to ride from the squadron to the airfield in one of the trucks. Every time they turned around there was another loyalty oath to be signed. They signed a loyalty oath to get their pay from the finance officer, to obtain their PX supplies, to have their hair cut by the Italian barbers. To Captain Black, every officer who supported his Glorious Loyalty Oath Crusade was a competitor, and he planned and plotted twenty-four hours a day to keep one step ahead. He would stand second to none in his devotion to country. When other officers had followed his urging and introduced loyalty oaths of their own, he went them one better by making every son of a bitch who came to his intelligence tent sign two loyalty oaths, then three, then four; then he introduced the pledge of allegiance, and after that "The Star-Spangled Banner," one chorus, two choruses, three choruses, four choruses. Each time Captain Black forged ahead of his competitors, he swung upon them scornfully for their failure to follow his example. Each time they followed his example, he retreated with concern and racked his brain for some new stratagem that would enable him to turn upon them scornfully again.

Without realizing how it had come about, the combat men in the squadron discovered themselves dominated by the administrators appointed to serve them. They were bullied, insulted, harassed and shoved about all day long by one after the other. When they voiced objection, Captain Black replied that people who were loyal would not mind signing all the loyalty oaths they had to. To anyone who questioned the effectiveness of the loyalty oaths, he replied that people who really did owe allegiance to their country would be proud to pledge it as often as he forced them to. And to anyone who questioned the morality, he replied that "The Star-Spangled Banner" was the greatest piece of music ever composed. The more loyalty oaths a person signed, the more loyal he was; to Captain Black it was as simple as that, and he had Corporal Kolodny sign hundreds with his name each day so that he could always prove he was more loyal than anyone else.

"The important thing is to keep them pledging," he explained to his cohorts. "It doesn't matter whether they mean it or not. That's why they make little kids pledge allegiance even before they know what 'pledge' and 'allegiance' means."

To Captain Piltchard and Captain Wren, the Glorious Loyalty Oath Crusade was a glorious pain in the ass, since it complicated their task of organizing the crews for each combat mission. Men were tied up all over the squadron signing, pledging and singing, and the missions took hours longer to get under way. Effective emergency action became impossible, but Captain Piltchard and Captain Wren were both too timid to raise any outcry against Captain Black, who scrupulously enforced each day the doctrine of "Continual Reaffirmation" that he had originated, a doctrine designed to trap all those men who had become disloyal since the last time they had signed a loyalty oath the day before. It was Captain Black who came with advice to Captain Piltchard and Captain Wren as they pitched about in their bewildering predicament. He came with a delegation and advised them bluntly to m ake each man sign a loyalty oath before allowing him to fly on a combat mission.

"Of course, it's up to you," Captain Black pointed out. "Nobody's trying to pressure you. But everyone else is making them sign loyalty oaths, and it's going to look mighty funny to the F.B.I. if you two are the only ones who don't care enough about your country to make them sign loyalty oaths, too. If you want to get a bad reputation, that's nobody's business but your own. All we're trying to do is help."

Milo was not convinced and absolutely refused to deprive Major Major of food, even if Major Major was a Communist, which Milo secretly doubted. Milo was by nature opposed to any innovation that threatened to disrupt the normal course of affairs. Milo took a firm moral stand and absolutely refused to participate in the Glorious Loyalty Oath Crusade until Captain Black called upon him with his delegation and requested him to.

"National defense is everybody's job," Captain Black replied to Milo's objection. "And this whole program is voluntary, Milo - don't forget that. The men don't have to sign Piltchard and Wren's loyalty oath if they don't want to. But we need you to starve them to death if they don't. It's just like Catch-22. Don't you get it? You're not against Catch-22, are you?"

Doc Daneeka was adamant.

"What makes you so sure Major Major is a Communist?"

"You never heard him denying it until we began accusing him, did you? And you don't see him signing any of our loyalty oaths."

"You aren't letting him sign any."

"Of course not," Captain Black explained. "That would defeat the whole purpose of our crusade. Look, you don't have to play ball with us if you don't want to. But what's the point of the rest of us working so hard if you're going to give Major Major medical attention the minute Milo begins starving him to death? I just wonder what they're going to think up at Group about the man who's undermining our whole security program. They'll probably transfer you to the Pacific."[/tt]

[fyre]

+1 for copypasta goodness

[sarcasticsteve]

+1 for copypasta goodness

+1 from me as well

[Sponson]

People everywhere are stupid. How surprising.

[MrGrey]

pledge of allegiance is just another form of controlling the youth... making them "pledge" their automatic support and loyalty to a SYMBOL that stands for opposing all who have different beliefs and perspectives.  AKA fascism. 

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

[Greatbacon]

[quote author=fyre link=topic=2808.msg80420#msg80420 date=1241474165]
+1 for copypasta goodness

+1 from me as well
[/quote]I love Catch 22  +1

[Versus]

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

[fyre]

pledge of allegiance is just another form of controlling the youth... making them "pledge" their automatic support and loyalty to a SYMBOL that stands for opposing all who have different beliefs and perspectives.  AKA fascism. 

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

the most basic form of manipulation or mind control is repetition

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

ron paul 08

lolol i see wat u did thar

[sarcasticsteve]

Engie > Spy

Engie > Spy

Engie > Spy

Engie > Spy

Engie > Spy

Engie > Spy

[Riosan]

nothing wrong with the pledge

mr grey and the like are too tinfoil hatty

[MrGrey]

i cant see anything wrong with the pledge because bill orilley is my master

mr grey and the like, however, are the few who are capable of paradigm thinking and point out inconsistencies and hypocrisy whenever evident.  As i understand this, i still respectfully disagree with them.

fixed that for u.

[Riosan]

mr grey is still too tinfoil hatty

[MrGrey]

mr grey is still too tinfoil hatty

jack black.