[WIP] cp_secretbase

[ZargonX]

For those of you that were there for the first playtest a while back, I've finally done the next major upgrade to secretbase.

It's available for download here: http://forums.tf2maps.net/downloads.php?do=file&id=197

And the changelog so far...

04/27/08
=========
Changes
-Major texture/detail work on cap 3 + 4 areas.
-func_respawnroomvisualizers corrected.
-Spawnroom doors should function correctly now.
-Added new entry point for Blue to Cap 5 area.

Known Issues
-Cap 5 and 6 area still needs texture/detail/lighting.
-Submarine in spawn 1 still brushwork; should be model.
=========

03/17/08
=========
Minor Update:
-Fixed textures in Power Control area.
-Added lighting to hallway approaching final cap point.
=========

Perhaps we could run another test during TFT this week?

[Vandamguy]

i would be so in for that.

but you realize that this TFT is the same day as GTA4 release.  .  .  . i may not be able to stop kicking dead hookers

[CaffeinePowered]

Meh to GTA, Ill throw it up on the server for Tuesday

[ZargonX]

Thanks!

I hope to have the last section done by next week, but that depends on what kind of feedback I get tomorrow...

[Budr]

Had a quick run around in it on my own and seems very well done indeed, looking forward to playing it on a populated server.

[Fail Medic]

I'd have to play it some more to really form an opinion.  I think some of the area are a bit too... "corridor-y"... for my tastes, but other than that, nice art, had fun on it, and I'd want to play it again.

[ZargonX]

Thanks for the playtesting, all!  It definitely gave me some good feedback.  Main things I think people noted...

-Alternate route needed out of Blue Spawn 1
-Alternate route needed out of Blue Spawn 2
-Player noclips needed along edges of raised metal walkway around Cap Point 2 (helipad)
-Ramp up to balcony area above CP2
-Speed up cap time on CP2
-Light needed in underwater tunnel by submarine bay
-Yellow shadows need to not be... yellow.
-General improvement to open-ness of larger areas

I'm sure there were some other things I forgot, so post away!

[jorge]

-Bloodthirsty sharks/alligators under that bridge

[CaffeinePowered]

Alright, Ill be brutally honest with my feedback and what I feel needs to be changed.

First The Good:
- Very well detailed
- Nice Textures
- Cap 1a and 1b - good layout
- Unique Design
- Overall good lighting

The Bad:
- Cap one underwater exit needs lights
- Add like a floor lamp or something behind that rock on cap 1b
- No clip brushes on floors of cap 1b so people don't get stuck
- Any doors that are decor use the texture with the big 'No Entry' symbol on them
- Add Respawn barriers on cap 1 and 2
- Stairs behind cap 2 that go up should be no_build area, or blocked - SG too easily hidden/hard to take down
- Some props (like the lightbulbs on cap 1 spawn) need to be set to like vphysics = no or something like that, so players clip through them

The Ugly:
- Lopsided for defenders, on both caps
- Respawns needs more alternate exits, on cap 1, split the main exit to two doors like in Dbowl cap 3, on cap 2 add an alternate exit on the lower level, also split like dbowl.
- Felt very cramped, little room to maneuver and little/no cover. Hallways over need to be wider to allow for some strafing, it felt like you had to march down them 1 at a time
- Little way to bypass choke-points or push through them, too easy to cover with demos/soldiers - see first point about lop-sidedness
- Cap 2b is way too small and cramped, a well placed SG could cover the entire thing


Overall this map has a lot of potential, looks great, but flow and game balance are sorely lacking, even with the lopsided amount of medics we were using, I think class selections were fairly balanced, and we still couldn't make any head way, for either team.

If somehow we could combine your ability to texture and detail with my layout we could have some form of super-map.

[DrkAdonis]

If somehow we could combine your ability to texture and detail with my layout we could have some form of super-map.

By your powers combined...

[Tragic Hero]

Great map, really enjoyed it.    Not perfect of course but it was good looking and I did enjoy the layout of it.  I would go about what needs to be fixed but Caf pretty much nailed it all.  Look forward to it again.

Grade:  B

[ZargonX]

Thanks, guys.  Definitely good points on all matters, and I've gotten some ideas for addressing many of those issues.  I'll keep you posted!

[ZargonX]

Ok, just finished up some changes to section I...



The green arrow on the right marks a new exit from the blue spawn into the Cap1 area.  The left arrow is the new hallway down from Cap1 into the rear of the helipad area (Cap2)



A closer view of the Cap2 changes.  In addition to the new access point, the whole area has been enlarged to open things up a bit.  Was a bit too favored towards the defender previously.



A quick look at the new Blue entrance into Cap1 (the Gate 1)



And a quick look at the expanded Cap2 area.

Still some lighting work that needs to be added, but I think these changes should help some of the issues we encountered during playtesting.  Now on to section II!

[Vandamguy]

i really dig this map , you need to quit your job and finish it

[CaffeinePowered]

Love the changes so far, looking forward to see what you do with cap 2

[ZargonX]

Updated! http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/53118

If we could squeeze this in for tomorrow night, that'd be great.  Points 5 and 6 are still under construction, but I'd like to test all the changes to the first 2/3.

[ZargonX]

Super thread bump!

For anybody that played it on TNF tonight, any feedback about changes would be much appreciated!

[Geoff]

...

I'm glad you weren't there.

Them be fighting words.

[CaffeinePowered]

Yea, some thing really need to be done about the choke points and large open areas

Part 1

Cap 1 - from the main tunnel, one needs to split off and go up into that glassed in control area, this will level the playing field between red and blue, right now red has vastly superior firing position. Also the current 2 entrances, split the tunnels up a bit more or add some cover by one of the doors, so one SentryGun can't cover both doors.

Cap 2 - Did not get significant play time on here. Steamrolled from Cap 1


Part 2

Cap 1 - there needs to be an entrance on the ground, and more cover down there too, some kind of props, clutter, ect to break up the line of site. The capture area needs to be wider so you can just barely cap it without exposing yourself to spam down that hallway.

Cap 2 - We steamrolled this from 1, unable to make a good assessment of how tough of a nut it is to crack.


Part 3

Cap 1 - Still very very tough to cap, I had to spawn camp as a heavy for Blue to cap. For starters, move up the respawn room visualizers, just make any area behind the visualizer a 'no build' area. The little drop down pit is a good addition, however, you still have to expose yourself to go up the left side, have another hall way so I don't have to go into the middle.

Make another covered path like that one on the left (blue's perspective) on the right that leads to the top. Additionally, extend the catwalks all the way to the wall where blue comes out of, add an exit or two for blue to come out of up top.

Move cap 2 father back from 1, make red run a greater distance to get to cap 1.

Cap 2 - Move red's cap to the part of the room farther away from where blue enters, add a catwalk to the upper area of that room, or something, the room seems rather bare and I don't know what you are planning on doing with it. But the spawn needs to be moved to be farther away and there needs to be more than one exit from it.


Overall, we had one team get stopped on the very first cap, and the other steamroll with a hiccup on Part 3 cap 1. Teams were fairly stacked and I had to spawn camp to get Part 3 Cap 1, very dirty tactics. I think if you make those changes to the first two caps, especially to break up line of sight and give people an alternate exit, it will really help.

[ZargonX]

Ugh... well, I'm sorry to hear is was so bad.  Back to the drawing board, I guess...