BRB #1 Rotation Horseshit/Bullshit/Pile of Shit.

[sarcasticsteve]

[quote author=Wedge link=topic=2637.msg74817#msg74817 date=1238973435]
Oh and the current rotation isn't that bad [...]

... except for 2fort.
[/quote]

2Fort is a classic.  A vastly overplayed classic but it's good to see it playable.

[Radio Raheem]

no 2fort is trash and empties servers

[Wedge]

Oh and btw, the main problem with the server right now is the swift->switchback part in the rotation.  It was doing reasonably well until we hit swift, and then totally dead after that.

[sarcasticsteve]

The rotation has hit a good stride, just needs some tweaking now that we are back on proper track.

[KarthXLR]

Oh and btw, the main problem with the server right now is the swift->switchback part in the rotation.  It was doing reasonably well until we hit swift, and then totally dead after that.

It saddens me to say that we probably shouldn't include any map over 4 or 5 megabytes on the server. People get really impatient.

The rotation has hit a good stride, just needs some tweaking now that we are back on proper track.

I say we should take off most customs (especially freight, swift, and switchback) so we can keep the server going. And I still say we at least have one arena map considering that it's a server filler.

[zaneyard]

I like the server rotation.

[Honest]

I like turtles.

[Versus]

[quote author=Wedge link=topic=2637.msg74869#msg74869 date=1238990355]
Oh and btw, the main problem with the server right now is the swift->switchback part in the rotation.  It was doing reasonably well until we hit swift, and then totally dead after that.

It saddens me to say that we probably shouldn't include any map over 4 or 5 megabytes on the server. People get really impatient.

The rotation has hit a good stride, just needs some tweaking now that we are back on proper track.

I say we should take off most customs (especially freight, swift, and switchback) so we can keep the server going. And I still say we at least have one arena map considering that it's a server filler.
[/quote]

Arena makes me leave the server, unless there's only a couple of people on (2-8). D:

[ScottyGrayskull]

Oh and the current rotation isn't that bad, except having swift and switchback together is fucking terrible, as this is what usually kills the server.  Swift should be removed from rotation (it's not that good of a map anyways).  And we need to have a few more stock maps (db/gr etc) to keep pops up.  Yeah.

And the random maps that can appear in RTV need to be cleaned up for sure.  If it's possible to leave maps on nomination but NOT show up randomly in rtv, that would be good.  IE remove all arena maps and a bunch of random betas that never got played much from it.

I almost gotta wonder if rtv should be disabled completely, or at least heavily limited (as in, you rtv to a map you can't rtv again until the next map, you can't rtv in the first round on a map).

IMO rtv kills the server far more than rotation maps do, especially with the massive amount of maps we have to choose from. If we have a solid rotation the few people who gripe (fuck you, ctf and 2fort are awesome ) can go away for a bit.

[Wedge]

We don't need to remove rtv, we need to reduce the round time, or switch to a round # method, because it always gets used when a map is going on too long. 

[Luca Shoal]

I like Kor

<3

[zaneyard]

[quote author=zaneyard link=topic=2637.msg74874#msg74874 date=1238991022]
I like Vaginas

<3

[/quote]

[Loqutus]

cp_freight
ctf_impact2
cp_gravelpit
pl_swift_final
cp_switchback_b5
ctf_2fort

cp_egypt_final

I think some solid contenders for those extra 5 SIX (forgot 2fort) spots I'd prefer were vacant are:

cp_granary
cp_roswell
cp_science2
pl_goldrush

making the list thus:

cp_gravelpit
cp_labor
pl_badwater
cp_warpath2
cp_granary
cp_roswell
cp_science2
pl_goldrush

What I can't decide is whether the rotation should be ordered stock, custom, stock, custom, etc... or stock stock stock stock custom custom custom custom... I don't know which would be more beneficial to keeping a server full?

[Radio Raheem]

labor and warpath hardly count as customs anyway. science2 however will empty servers. anyone showing up for stocks doesnt feel like downloading likely bad maps

[Aerox]

I might as well chime in.

I would support dumping RTV, because more often than not people will just rock the vote if anyone else rocks it, even if the map that's being played is going well. All it takes is one person who decides they want to play something else and it's almost guaranteed the map will change. If people REALLY want to play a totally different map and everyone is in agreement, we have enough admins that it shouldn't be super hard to find one and get them to jump in and change the map.

This would be my ideal rotation:

Turbine
Dustbowl
Mach 4 Impact
Goldrush
Labor Steel
Gravelpit
2Fort (I know a lot of people don't like it, but it fills the server and it's really not that bad if you get two good teams on it)
Freight
Badwater
Stag ROTATING CUSTOM (This still makes the map testing we do in TFT relevant, and will keep people from getting TOO bored at least with the exact same rotation. One rotating spot for a really good custom I think is a good idea. Rotating once every two weeks or once a month is what I envision.)

I'll be honest, a lot of the custom maps we have on the server just plain aren't very much fun.

I struggled with adding Warparth, because I love Warpath, but one of the big problems I have with it is that if you don't have full teams, it's kind of shit, and it also goes on FOREVER. It should absolutely be a staple of TFT and FNF, but I'd be hesitant to add it into the rotation. Arena sucks, simply because it's more sitting than actual playing (and this is also my problem with RPS, although less actual sitting and more "We all know exactly what is going to happen and it's pointless"). When I get home from work and turn on TF2, I actually want to play TF2 and not just sit around doing bullshit. My play time is limited.

Also Kor I love you.

[Wedge]

Please don't talk about a map going on forever when you have Labor on rotation.  WP2 is nothing compared to the endless boredom of Labor.  The only time WP2 drags on is if BOTH teams are totally incompetent and/or stacked with 3/4 engineers built at the second point.  Which ruins most maps, just WP2 more so.  In any case, I can't remember the last time I've played a match of WP2 that went on forever.  Labor on the other hand... is almost every time I play it.

Also WP2 should supersede Labor in any rotation =/.

Also Steel should be on any rotation because you can't complain about it being a custom now and it's fucking awesome.

Also I still say using round limit instead of time limit would help the overuse of rtv.

[Aerox]

Please don't talk about a map going on forever when you have Labor on rotation.  WP2 is nothing compared to the endless boredom of Labor.  The only time WP2 drags on is if BOTH teams are totally incompetent and/or stacked with 3/4 engineers built at the second point.  Which ruins most maps, just WP2 more so.  In any case, I can't remember the last time I've played a match of WP2 that went on forever.  Labor on the other hand... is almost every time I play it.

Also WP2 should supersede Labor in any rotation =/.

Also Steel should be on any rotation because you can't complain about it being a custom now and it's fucking awesome.

Also I still say using round limit instead of time limit would help the overuse of rtv.

That's fair, Labor tends to stalemate fairly often as well as I think about it. My recent matches on it haven't been excessively long, but I know in the past they've dragged on. Replacing it with Steel is fine with me.

Overall for my list though, it's not so much my 10 favorite maps up there. There are a number of maps I like better, but for one reason or another, don't serve the ultimate purpose of filling the server and keeping it seeded. I tried to pick maps that: A. People are likely to have, B. Aren't super confusing so new people don't get scared and leave, and (I think most importantly) C. Play well when the server is half full and just as well when the server is entirely full. As much as I love WP, the problem both it and Switchback have is that it's massive and designed to be played with a full server of people. 6 on 6 on Mach 4, or even 2Fort or Badwater, while not ideal, isn't terrible. I've never had a good experience on Warpath with small teams though. It's not an issue when we have a full server obviously, but I've seen the server empty on Warpath a number of times right when we were in the middle of filling it.

I'm not saying Warpath isn't a good map, I just don't know if it accomplishes what we're trying to do with the rotation.

[copulatingduck]

#3 is the new #1 imo.

[CaffeinePowered]

Warpath2 has the timer fix so it will END after 30 minutes, unlike the original version which would keep adding time and never end until one team capped out

I like Aerox's suggestion, but I feel like Mach4 is over played and if we want a custom CTF map in there I'd go with 2docks, geothermal, impact2, or something else. I think if you took Aerox's suggestion and then added in like 2 more customs after popular stock maps it would be good.

I will not be deciding the final rotation, leaving that up to Kor.

[Aerox]

Impact2 would be a good replacement I think.